Q: you gave 12 institutions $241 million dollars “race neutrality.”
Kennedy: In 2020, you created a program called The Faculty Institutional Recruitment for Sustainable Transformation. And basically, under the program, you gave 12 institutions $241 million dollars. A lot of jack in anybody’s book … to demonstrate a strong commitment to promoting diversity and inclusive excellence when you hire people … South Carolina and New Mexico issued rules to administer the money that you gave them, and they both said that we are going to punish candidates who apply for jobs with us with this money that you gave them, who espouse “race neutrality.” In other words, both of those institutions said, “We’re going to give a very low score for anyone who states an intention to ignore the varying backgrounds of their students and treat everyone the same.”

Q: we don’t believe in racial prejudice gets an F; Do you know anybody against diversity?
Kennedy: So, they took your money and they said, “We’re hiring faculty members, and any applicant who says we want… we don’t believe in racial prejudice, we think everybody ought to be treated the same, gets an F.” Did you know that?

Tabak: I’m not familiar with the specifics that you are mentioning, Senator.
Kennedy: Would you look into it?
Tabak: I certainly will. This program is an important effort by NIH to create a more highly diverse workforce.
Kennedy: I agree with that. It’s a good idea. I don’t… Do you know anybody against diversity?
Tabak: Well, unfortunately, sir,
Kennedy: I don’t.
Tabak: I’ve run across a few over the years,
Kennedy: but I’m sure there’s some out there. But I think most fair-minded people agree with that.
Tabak: But our effort is to create an environment where people from all backgrounds

Q: they get an F: “I believe in racial equality, I believe everybody should be treated the same”
Kennedy: That’s true. But here’s what I’m getting at. Do you think it’s fair for the University of New Mexico and the University of South Carolina, two extraordinary schools, to say to an applicant who’s borrowed hundreds of thousands of dollars to get her PhD, and who comes forward and they say, “How do you feel about race?” and they say, “I believe in racial equality, I believe everybody should be treated the same,” they get an F? They’re dismissed summarily. You think that’s fair to do that with your money, with taxpayer money?

Tabak: Again, sir, I can’t speak to the specifics of these institutions, and I will look into it.
Kennedy: Would if it’s true, do you support that?
Tabak: Again, I’d have to see what exactly it is,
Kennedy: but if it’s true, do you support it?
Tabak: I… What we are trying to do, sir, is create inclusive environments because, unfortunately, far too often, certain individuals

Q: Is that moral? Is that constitutional? only hire Asian Americans, anybody else need not apply
Kennedy: But if I hire somebody, suppose, can I, as an American, legally, constitutionally, morally say, “I’m only going to hire Asian Americans, anybody else of any different ethnic background need not apply”? Is that moral? Is that constitutional?

Tabak: Well, I’m… God knows I’m not a lawyer, but, sir…
Kennedy: But you’re a human being.

Tabak: To get to a faculty-level position is a multi-step process, and very often highly qualified candidates are never even considered because of where they train, where they’re from, or what they look like.

Kennedy: Yeah, but do you think… Well, none of that is fair. I think I don’t think you’re answering my question. Do you think it’s right for an institution, using money that you gave them, to say if you believe in racial equality and you say you want to treat everybody the same, a big old hook comes out and around their neck and pulls them off the stage and they say, “You’re not going to be hired”? Do you think that’s right?

Tabak: I just don’t… I would need to understand the context, sir, and I really don’t know what these institutions are saying to candidates, and I will certainly find out.

Kennedy: Well, I’m gonna follow up. I want to know. Fair enough. I mean, that’s how they spent taxpayer money that you gave them, and I’m going to follow up, and I wish you would too. This disturbs me because I don’t think that’s lawful.

Tabak: We will certainly get back to you, sir, with what we find.

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Senate Grilling: Taxpayer Money Used to Punish ‘Race Neutrality’ Applicants?